ما لنا

[aliaslam1992]

اسلام عليكم

How would grammatically analyze ما لنا , I have read that it's خبر محذوف . It's usually translated as "What is the matter with us" or "what is wrong with us"?

[benss]

'aleikoum salâm wa rahmatoullâh wa barakâtouh,

I would say:

ما = مبتدأ

and

لنا = جار و مجرور شبه جملة خبر

Indeed, replying to that question (ما لنا) one may say for instance:

لنا صُدَاعٌ
[We have a headache]

In the answer, we easily identify صُدَاعٌ as being the mubtada and that the latter is used at the place of ما .

Alternatively, in order to identify easily the grammatical structure of ما لنا,
one may remark that:
1) the sentence doesn't have any verb => it couldn't be a verbal sentence
2) given point 1), the sentence consists of two "blocs" ما and لنا. The latter being two words (jar wa majrour), thus it can't be mubtada and can only by khabar.
3) lastly, even if we keep in mind the general definition and the sense of mubtada and khabar: the mubatada is the "thing" we are talking about and for which we want to convey an information (khabar),
so what we're talking about in the sentence ? => answer ما , and what's the information about it ? => لنا, that is "it is ours/of us"

Got it ?

P.S: Just forget to make a remark about the fact that "[you] have read that it's خبر محذوف": this could be another alternative to analyze the sentence (actually any nominal sentences with shibhu jumla),
however this way of analyzing the sentence is not tackled in Medina books. So, I guess that when you said: "I have read that...", you mean not in Medina books, right ?

[hassan]

و عليكم السلام

Brother benss is right.

The maa used here is an interrogative noun meaning 'what'. Here maa is the mubtada, and the prepositional phrase la-naa is the khabar. Dr. Abdur Rahim quoted the similar sentences in Key3 and Glossary

Quote from Key3, Page 44
ما بك؟ 'What is wrong with you?' (Here ما is mubtada', and the prepositional phrase بك is the khabar).
~End Quote~


Quote from Glossary
ما لك؟, what is the matter with you?, what is wrong with you?
~End Quote~

[aliaslam1992]

I read this explanation in Noor ul Yaqeen regarding Qur'an 2:246.

The entire explanation for ما لنا is:
ما اسم استفهام في محل رفع مبتدا,لنا جار و مجرور متعلق بمحذوف خبر

[benss]

Originally Posted by aliaslam1992

I read this explanation in Noor ul Yaqeen regarding Qur'an 2:246.

The entire explanation for ما لنا is:
ما اسم استفهام في محل رفع مبتدا,لنا جار و مجرور متعلق بمحذوف خبر

This is indeed from Noor ul Yaqeen and this way of analyzing your sentence is not the way we have been taught by Ustâdh Asif.
Very briefly, there are "two schools of though" among grammarians:

1. those claiming that the way of analyzing such a sentence is the one you've just mentioned (and referred in Noor ul Yaqeen for instance) ,
   
2. and those who adopt the simplest way, that is the one I've mentioned and which is the one we've learnt from Ustâdh Assif.

I've indeed said in my last post:

P.S: Just forget to make a remark about the fact that "[you] have read that it's خبر محذوف": this could be another alternative to analyze the sentence (actually any nominal sentences with shibhu jumla),
however this way of analyzing the sentence is not tackled in Medina books. So, I guess that when you said: "I have read that...", you mean not in Medina books, right ?

You're answered to my question and so my advice is just to stick on the way we've been taught from Medina books inchaAllah and by doing so you'll avoid potential confusion.

[aliaslam1992]

I basically just wanted to know what the محذوف خبر IS, not what this phrase means, if anyone had any idea. I'm sorry if this goes outside the realm of the Madina Books, but could anyone also direct me to a forum where I could post such questions?

[irf2k]

Originally Posted by aliaslam1992

I basically just wanted to know what the محذوف خبر IS, not what this phrase means, if anyone had any idea. I'm sorry if this goes outside the realm of the Madina Books, but could anyone also direct me to a forum where I could post such questions?

Good Question.
Unfortunately the concept of jar wa majrur being متعلق is a concept above Madina books.
At this level it is enough to say jar wa majru khabar.

When one finished the 3 Madina Books then one can read advanced books written by Dr. Abdur Rahim where he explains these these advanced concepts.

Wassalaam

[hassan]

Originally Posted by aliaslam1992

I basically just wanted to know what the محذوف خبر IS, not what this phrase means, if anyone had any idea. I'm sorry if this goes outside the realm of the Madina Books, but could anyone also direct me to a forum where I could post such questions?

assalaamu alaikum.

The analysis says that the jaar majroor is muta'alliq to some khabar which is mahzoof. Now maybe the mufassiroon will tell you the mahzoof khabar. The mufassiroon may differ about its mahzoof khabar as well. Anyway, this needs an advance analysis and is beyond the scope of Madina Books. You can pose this question in Dr. Abdur Rahim's blog. InshaAllah you will get the answer there.

[Tanweer]

Originally Posted by aliaslam1992

I basically just wanted to know what the محذوف خبر IS, not what this phrase means, if anyone had any idea.

Brother, I think the answer is provided by you yourself, in your first post. As you worte:

"What is the matter with us"

What = mubtada
the matter = khabar
with us = jar-majrur, connected to the khabar

Now all you need is to know the Arabic word of "the matter". That will be your Mahzuf Khabar.

Similar Ayah [99:3]

وَقَالَ الْإِنسَانُ مَا لَهَا

And man cries (distressed): 'What is the matter with her?'-
[Yousuf Ali translation]