Doubt about the plural form أَفْعِلَاءُ

[aashifrashad]

Assalamu 'alaikum,

The plural form أَفْعِلَاءُ is said to be diptote which means it can never take a kasrah(If i'm correct)

and in the handout 1 the plural of نَبِيٌّ is give as أَنْبِيَاءُ which is in the form أَفْعِلَاءُ

If أَنْبِيَاءُ does not take a kasrah(being a diptote) Then why in the madinah mushaf (which i received from the ka'ba) the name of surah 21 is written as سُوْرَةُ الأَنْبِيَاءِ ?

[mohanedshaikh]

salaam.
one more quality of a diptote is that it doesnt take alif laam (AL) and when any diptote takes the article al with him, its no more called a diptote and function normally. inshallah u ll learn in the book one that some plural do have al with them even being diptotes. like attibbauu (the doctors) . when AL is attached they are no more called diptotes

[Tanweer]

Some brothers and sisters have two misconceptions about diptotes.

(1) Misconception: Diptotes do not take AL.
Correct conception: Diptotes can take AL, whenever it is necessary.

(2) Misconception: When diptote takes an AL, it is still a diptote.
Correct conception: When a diptote takes an AL, it is no longer a diptote. It behaves like a normal triptote. So, in that case, it can take Kasra when it is majrur.

See: Pages 151-152 of English key of Book # 3.....(It is the last chapter of Madina books !!!)

So Anbiyau is diptote, and it can not take kasra. But AL-anbiyau is triptote, so it can take kasra when majrur.

[aashifrashad]

JazakumaAllahu khairan brothers for taking your time to explain me. jaadakumAllahu 'ilmaa

[irf2k]

Originally Posted by Tanweer

Some brothers and sisters have two misconceptions about diptotes.

(1) Misconception: Diptotes do not take AL.
Correct conception: Diptotes can take AL, whenever it is necessary.

(2) Misconception: When diptote takes an AL, it is still a diptote.
Correct conception: When a diptote takes an AL, it is no longer a diptote. It behaves like a normal triptote. So, in that case, it can take Kasra when it is majrur.

See: Pages 151-152 of English key of Book # 3.....(It is the last chapter of Madina books !!!)

So Anbiyau is diptote, and it can not take kasra. But AL-anbiyau is triptote, so it can take kasra when majrur.

Very correct.
In addition if a diptote if mudaaf it becomes triptote, i.e. it will take kasrah when majrur.
I prayed in the Masjids of Toronto will be:
Sallaitu fi Masajidi Toronto.
Wassalam

[W.Syed]

SA

Instead of making a new thread I hope it is okay to just use this one as my question is related to it.

"zameelun" will become "azameeloo" when definite.

Now "zumala'oo" is the plural and it is a diptote. In this form ("zumala'oo") is it definite or indefinite or can we not know until we see the context ?

If "zumala'oo" is indefinite the can we simply make it "azumala'oo" to make it definite ?

JZK

Edit: On am side-note, just flicking through my volume 3 book and I don't see an English key, whereas my 1st and 2nd books do have one ? Do the volume 3 books not come with an English key in the same book ? Do they come in a different book ?

[benss]

Originally Posted by W.Syed

SA

Instead of making a new thread I hope it is okay to just use this one as my question is related to it.

"zameelun" will become "azameeloo" when definite.

Now "zumala'oo" is the plural and it is a diptote. In this form ("zumala'oo") is it definite or indefinite or can we not know until we see the context ?

If "zumala'oo" is indefinite the can we simply make it "azumala'oo" to make it definite ?

JZK

Edit: On am side-note, just flicking through my volume 3 book and I don't see an English key, whereas my 1st and 2nd books do have one ? Do the volume 3 books not come with an English key in the same book ? Do they come in a different book ?

Salâmuou'aleikoum wa rahmatoullâh wa barakâtouh,

i guess one have to keep in mind that the notion of diptote (الممنوع من الصرف) has nothing do to with the concept of definiteness/indefiniteness (التنكير و التعريف). Here I mean that both are treated independantly !

So, the fact that a noun is a diptote does not prevent it to take the article.

So, the answer to your question:

If "zumala'oo" is indefinite the can we simply make it "azumala'oo" to make it definite ?

is yes.


Below is an excelent and very concise lecture about diptote from Sheikh AbduRahîm's blog (May Allah reward him with the best reward):

http://drvaniya.com/wp-content/uploa...8-Diptotes.pdf


Wa salâmou'aleikoum wa rahmatoulâh wa barakâtouh.

[W.Syed]

Jzk for that,

I understand everything fine, that pdf on diptotes was quite comprehensive despite how short it was. Lastly, though, "zu ma la oo" is then indefinite, correct ?

[benss]

Originally Posted by W.Syed

Jzk for that,

I understand everything fine, that pdf on diptotes was quite comprehensive despite how short it was. Lastly, though, "zu ma la oo" is then indefinite, correct ?

yes it is.

[W.Syed]

Originally Posted by benss

yes it is.

JZK and do you have any light to shed on the edit in my original post ?:

On am side-note, just flicking through my volume 3 book and I don't see an English key, whereas my 1st and 2nd books do have one ? Do the volume 3 books not come with an English key in the same book ? Do they come in a different book ?